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 Post subject: Hot Start Enrichment Tables Found!
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2012 11:02 pm 
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I've had some requests lately to find another set of tables that cause hot-start issues. I've identified them in a couple roms, and I'm working on the definition.

If anyone wants to check it out, follow this process (for A8DH202X):

Find references to Final Fueling Base 4byte. First two are SSM 2-byte parameter conversions. The second two are calculations for Final Fuel Base. Go to the latter of these (which is called from the former).

In this routine, you will see the Primary Enrichment Final 4byte, added with a bunch of other enrichment parameters. This occurs at 0x2B5F0

The first one is the hot start enrichment. (FFFF7374) The 3rd, 4th, and 5th reference to this memory address do the calculations, and contain the relevant parameters (initial enrich, delay, decay step, timers, etc).

You can also find references to the Tau / Wall Wetting enrichment at the beginning of the routine that adds the enrichment values.

These definitions are uploaded to the GitHub Alpha repo here: https://github.com/Merp/SubaruDefs/tree/Alpha

Download entire Alpha repo: https://github.com/Merp/SubaruDefs/zipball/Alpha

Added some other roms, full list:
As of 9/3/12:
A8DH200X
A2UJ000J
AE5I500G
AZ1G101N
AE5I910V

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Last edited by Merp on Mon Sep 03, 2012 7:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Hot Start Enrichment Tables Found!
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:55 pm 
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I've got these and the post start tables defined for az1g101n and az1g202g, found them along with a bunch of other tables - for Ecuflash at least. Can post up if you want?

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 Post subject: Re: Hot Start Enrichment Tables Found!
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:05 pm 
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Ya buddy, post em if you got em :mrgreen: ECUFlash def is the way to go :)

Any luck finding a minimum (or max) IPW? I'm trying to determine if the limits occur in the 'preliminary' IPW, or after it is stored in the 4byte logger parameter.

I have just about all the routines marked out from injector scalar pull down to interaction with the ATU, but it is a horrible mess as usual, even without indirect referencing.

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 Post subject: Re: Hot Start Enrichment Tables Found!
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:07 pm 
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You got a PM ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Hot Start Enrichment Tables Found!
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:13 pm 
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Location: DSM, IA :: 2011 STi - Dom3.5XTR - E85
If either of you have some extra time, I would love to get definitions for this for my rom: AE5I910V

With E85 and bigger injectors, running rich AFRs on hot starts causes enough misfiring to throw a CEL which is highly annoying.

I be happy to test anything out and get this issue tuned out.

Thanks! :D


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 Post subject: Re: Hot Start Enrichment Tables Found!
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:14 pm 
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If I recall correctly, I managed to trace down the minimum IPW in az1g101n - will need to check, I've been travelling for a while...

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 Post subject: Re: Hot Start Enrichment Tables Found!
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:18 pm 
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wrxt4cy wrote:
If either of you have some extra time, I would love to get definitions for this for my rom: AE5I910V

With E85 and bigger injectors, running rich AFRs on hot starts causes enough misfiring to throw a CEL which is highly annoying.

I be happy to test anything out and get this issue tuned out.

Thanks! :D


Yeah - I posted up in the AF3 thread a couple of days ago that I would dig them out for you, was surprised you didn't take up the offer ;) I think it got lost in the later posts - viewtopic.php?f=34&t=8131&start=60

EDIT - I've also got the misfire DTC threshold defined, might be useful.

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 Post subject: Re: Hot Start Enrichment Tables Found!
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:24 pm 
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This is for AZ1G101N, as well as the misfire DTC threshold and MAP count threshold:

Code:
   <scaling name="Hot Restart 1" units="units" toexpr="x" frexpr="x" format="%.4f" min="0" max="255" inc="1" storagetype="float" endian="big"/>
   <scaling name="Hot Restart 2" units="units" toexpr="x" frexpr="x" format="%.0f" min="0" max="255" inc="1" storagetype="uint16" endian="big"/>

   <table name="Misfire Count MAP Threshold" category="Misfire" address="c5670" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Pressure (bar)">
      <table name="X" category="Misfire" address="c5638" type="X Axis" elements="14" scaling="RPM"/>
   </table>

   <table name="Misfire DTC Threshold" category="Misfire" address="c57bc" type="3D" level="1" scaling="Misfire DTC">
      <table name="Engine Load" address="c575c" type="X Axis" elements="10" scaling="EngineLoad(g/rev)1"/>
      <table name="Engine Speed" address="c5784" type="Y Axis" elements="14" scaling="RPM"/>
   </table>

   <table name="hot_restart_enrich_decay_delay" category="Hot Restart" address="c7334" type="1D" level="1" scaling="Hot Restart 2"/>

   <table name="hot_restart_enrich_decay_step_value" category="Hot Restart" address="c7908" type="1D" level="1" scaling="Hot Restart 1"/>

   <table name="hot_restart_enrich_initial_high" category="Hot Restart" address="c78fc" type="1D" level="1" scaling="Hot Restart 1"/>

   <table name="hot_restart_enrich_initial_high_activat_min_coolant_temp" category="Hot Restart" address="c78ec" type="1D" level="1" scaling="Hot Restart 1"/>

   <table name="hot_restart_enrich_initial_high_activat_min_intake_temp" category="Hot Restart" address="c78f0" type="1D" level="1" scaling="Hot Restart 1"/>

   <table name="hot_restart_enrich_initial_low" category="Hot Restart" address="c7900" type="1D" level="1" scaling="Hot Restart 1"/>

   <table name="hot_restart_enrich_initial_low_activat_min_coolant_temp" category="Hot Restart" address="c78f4" type="1D" level="1" scaling="Hot Restart 1"/>

   <table name="hot_restart_enrich_initial_low_activat_min_intake_temp" category="Hot Restart" address="c78f8" type="1D" level="1" scaling="Hot Restart 1"/>

   <table name="hot_restart_enrich_max_non_idle" category="Hot Restart" address="c790c" type="1D" level="1" scaling="Hot Restart 1"/>

   <table name="hot_restart_enrich_max_non_idle_activation_max_run_time" category="Hot Restart" address="c7338" type="1D" level="2" scaling="Hot Restart 2"/>

   <table name="hot_restart_enrich_min_lim_activat_max_run_time" category="Hot Restart" address="c7336" type="1D" level="1" scaling="Hot Restart 2"/>

   <table name="hot_restart_enrich_min_limit" category="Hot Restart" address="c7904" type="1D" level="1" scaling="Hot Restart 1"/>

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 Post subject: Re: Hot Start Enrichment Tables Found!
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:30 pm 
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Post start tables / parameters for AZ1G101N:

Code:
   <scaling name="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay" units="units" toexpr="x*0.00024414062" frexpr="x/0.00024414062" format="%.4f" min="0" max="255" inc="1" storagetype="uint16" endian="big"/>
   <scaling name="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay1" units="units" toexpr="x*0.00390625" frexpr="x/0.00390625" format="%.3f" min="0" max="255" inc="1" storagetype="uint16" endian="big"/>
   <scaling name="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay2" units="units" toexpr="x*0.00000095367432" frexpr="x/0.00000095367432" format="%.5f" min="0" max="255" inc="1" storagetype="uint16" endian="big"/>
   <scaling name="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay3" units="units" toexpr="x" frexpr="x" format="%.0f" min="0" max="255" inc="1" storagetype="uint8" endian="big"/>
   <scaling name="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay4" units="units" toexpr="x*0.0078125" frexpr="x/0.0078125" format="%.3f" min="0" max="255" inc="1" storagetype="uint8" endian="big"/>

   <table name="Table_Post_Start_Enrich_High_Speed_Decay_Initial_Start_1A" category="Post Start Enrichment" address="C8A76" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay">
      <table name="Coolant Temperature" address="C7C54" type="X Axis" elements="16" scaling="CoolantTemp(DegreesF)"/>
   </table>

   <table name="Table_Post_Start_Enrich_High_Speed_Decay_Initial_Start_1B" category="Post Start Enrichment" address="C8AD6" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay">
      <table name="Coolant Temperature" address="C7C54" type="X Axis" elements="16" scaling="CoolantTemp(DegreesF)"/>
   </table>

   <table name="Table_Post_Start_Enrich_High_Speed_Decay_Initial_Start_2A" category="Post Start Enrichment" address="C8B16" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay">
      <table name="Coolant Temperature" address="C7C54" type="X Axis" elements="16" scaling="CoolantTemp(DegreesF)"/>
   </table>

   <table name="Table_Post_Start_Enrich_High_Speed_Decay_Initial_Start_2B" category="Post Start Enrichment" address="C8B76" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay">
      <table name="Coolant Temperature" address="C7C54" type="X Axis" elements="16" scaling="CoolantTemp(DegreesF)"/>
   </table>
   
   <table name="Table_Post_Start_Enrich_Low_Speed_Decay_Initial_1A" category="Post Start Enrichment" address="C89D6" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay1">
      <table name="Coolant Temperature" address="C7C54" type="X Axis" elements="16" scaling="CoolantTemp(DegreesF)"/>
   </table>
   
   <table name="Table_Post_Start_Enrich_Low_Speed_Decay_Initial_1B" category="Post Start Enrichment" address="C89F6" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay1">
      <table name="Coolant Temperature" address="C7C54" type="X Axis" elements="16" scaling="CoolantTemp(DegreesF)"/>
   </table>
   
   <table name="Table_Post_Start_Enrich_Low_Speed_Decay_Initial_2A" category="Post Start Enrichment" address="C8A16" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay1">
      <table name="Coolant Temperature" address="C7C54" type="X Axis" elements="16" scaling="CoolantTemp(DegreesF)"/>
   </table>
   
   <table name="Table_Post_Start_Enrich_Low_Speed_Decay_Initial_2B" category="Post Start Enrichment" address="C8A36" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay1">
      <table name="Coolant Temperature" address="C7C54" type="X Axis" elements="16" scaling="CoolantTemp(DegreesF)"/>
   </table>

   <table name="Table_Post_Start_Enrich_High_Speed_Decay_Step_Value_1" category="Post Start Enrichment" address="C8BD6" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay2">
      <table name="Coolant Temperature" address="C7C54" type="X Axis" elements="16" scaling="CoolantTemp(DegreesF)"/>
   </table>

   <table name="Table_Post_Start_Enrich_High_Speed_Decay_Step_Value_2" category="Post Start Enrichment" address="C8C16" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay2">
      <table name="Coolant Temperature" address="C7C54" type="X Axis" elements="16" scaling="CoolantTemp(DegreesF)"/>
   </table>

   <table name="Table_Post_Start_Enrich_Low_Speed_Decay_Delay_1" category="Post Start Enrichment" address="C7F11" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay3">
      <table name="Coolant Temperature" address="C7C54" type="X Axis" elements="16" scaling="CoolantTemp(DegreesF)"/>
   </table>

   <table name="Table_Post_Start_Enrich_Low_Speed_Decay_Delay_2" category="Post Start Enrichment" address="C7F21" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay3">
      <table name="Coolant Temperature" address="C7C54" type="X Axis" elements="16" scaling="CoolantTemp(DegreesF)"/>
   </table>

   <table name="Table_Post_Start_Enrich_Low_Speed_Decay_Delay_Multiplier" category="Post Start Enrichment" address="C7F31" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Post_Start_Enrich_Decay4">
      <table name="Coolant Temperature" address="C7C54" type="X Axis" elements="16" scaling="CoolantTemp(DegreesF)"/>
   </table>
   

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 Post subject: Re: Hot Start Enrichment Tables Found!
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 4:00 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:09 pm
Posts: 183
Location: DSM, IA :: 2011 STi - Dom3.5XTR - E85
td-d wrote:
wrxt4cy wrote:
If either of you have some extra time, I would love to get definitions for this for my rom: AE5I910V

With E85 and bigger injectors, running rich AFRs on hot starts causes enough misfiring to throw a CEL which is highly annoying.

I be happy to test anything out and get this issue tuned out.

Thanks! :D


Yeah - I posted up in the AF3 thread a couple of days ago that I would dig them out for you, was surprised you didn't take up the offer ;) I think it got lost in the later posts - viewtopic.php?f=34&t=8131&start=60

EDIT - I've also got the misfire DTC threshold defined, might be useful.


Yeah - I sure did miss that. I scrolled up to the post right after yours thinking that was the newest post.

Both of these things would be very helpful. :)

Thanks!

Edit: I noticed in some older roms there are a bunch of tables under Warm-up Enrichment that seem similar to what you are defining here. In both the older roms and my own, there are tables called "Min Primary Base Enrichment 1". Older roms have A/B tables, I have Cruise/Non-cruise. In the older roms, there are additional tables that I don't have. There are "Enrich 2 & Enrich 3 sets and each set has 4 Initial Start tables. There are also decay step tables and some delay and multiplier tables.

Are these extra tables what you guys are calling "Hot start enrichment"? The 3 basic tables I have in my rom don't apply any enrichment at low loads and higher ECTs so they wouldn't be coming into play. Am I understanding correctly that I need these other tables defined in order to tune out enrichments that do take place at higher ECTs?

Sorry for the extra questions, I'm just trying to understand if warm-up enrichment also controls hot start enrichment or if they are completely different things.


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 Post subject: Re: Hot Start Enrichment Tables Found!
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 6:57 pm 
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Posts: 760
Location: Pennsyltucky
wrxt4cy wrote:
td-d wrote:
wrxt4cy wrote:
If either of you have some extra time, I would love to get definitions for this for my rom: AE5I910V

With E85 and bigger injectors, running rich AFRs on hot starts causes enough misfiring to throw a CEL which is highly annoying.

I be happy to test anything out and get this issue tuned out.

Thanks! :D


Yeah - I posted up in the AF3 thread a couple of days ago that I would dig them out for you, was surprised you didn't take up the offer ;) I think it got lost in the later posts - viewtopic.php?f=34&t=8131&start=60

EDIT - I've also got the misfire DTC threshold defined, might be useful.


Yeah - I sure did miss that. I scrolled up to the post right after yours thinking that was the newest post.

Both of these things would be very helpful. :)

Thanks!

Edit: I noticed in some older roms there are a bunch of tables under Warm-up Enrichment that seem similar to what you are defining here. In both the older roms and my own, there are tables called "Min Primary Base Enrichment 1". Older roms have A/B tables, I have Cruise/Non-cruise. In the older roms, there are additional tables that I don't have. There are "Enrich 2 & Enrich 3 sets and each set has 4 Initial Start tables. There are also decay step tables and some delay and multiplier tables.

Are these extra tables what you guys are calling "Hot start enrichment"? The 3 basic tables I have in my rom don't apply any enrichment at low loads and higher ECTs so they wouldn't be coming into play. Am I understanding correctly that I need these other tables defined in order to tune out enrichments that do take place at higher ECTs?

Sorry for the extra questions, I'm just trying to understand if warm-up enrichment also controls hot start enrichment or if they are completely different things.


You are correct. They are two different sets of enrichment calculations, but they are added together in the calculation of Final Fueling Base, which determines actual injector PW.

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 Post subject: Re: Hot Start Enrichment Tables Found!
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 7:09 pm 
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Location: Johannesburg, South Africa
Ok, here are the addresses for AE5I910V - no time to code them into XML, but you can use the definitions above. Use the address after each 'ROM:'

Code:
ROM:000CA188 hot_restart_enrich_decay_delay:.data.w h'BC ; DATA XREF: sub_358EC+78o
ROM:000CA188                                         ; sub_358EC+140o ...
ROM:000CA18A hot_restart_enrich_min_lim_activat_max_run_time:.data.w h'2BF2
ROM:000CA18A                                         ; DATA XREF: sub_358EC+152o
ROM:000CA18A                                         ; ROM:off_35B08o
ROM:000CA18C hot_restart_enrich_max_non_idle_activation_max_run_time:.data.w h'270

ROM:000CA71C hot_restart_enrich_initial_high_activat_min_coolant_temp:.float 85.0
ROM:000CA71C                                         ; DATA XREF: sub_358A8+8o
ROM:000CA71C                                         ; ROM:off_35A98o
ROM:000CA720 hot_restart_enrich_initial_high_activat_min_intake_temp:.float 50.0
ROM:000CA720                                         ; DATA XREF: sub_358A8+10o
ROM:000CA720                                         ; ROM:off_35A9Co
ROM:000CA724 hot_restart_enrich_initial_low_activat_min_coolant_temp:.float 79.0
ROM:000CA724                                         ; DATA XREF: sub_358A8:loc_358CAo
ROM:000CA724                                         ; ROM:off_35AA8o ...
ROM:000CA728 hot_restart_enrich_initial_low_activat_min_intake_temp:.float 0.0
ROM:000CA728                                         ; DATA XREF: sub_358A8+2Ao
ROM:000CA728                                         ; ROM:off_35AACo ...
ROM:000CA72C hot_restart_enrich_initial_high:.float 0.29999998 ; DATA XREF: sub_358A8+18o
ROM:000CA72C                                         ; ROM:off_35AA0o
ROM:000CA730 hot_restart_enrich_initial_low:.float 0.29999998 ; DATA XREF: sub_358A8+32o
ROM:000CA730                                         ; ROM:off_35AB0o
ROM:000CA734 hot_restart_enrich_min_limit:.float 0.19999999 ; DATA XREF: sub_358EC+16Ao
ROM:000CA734                                         ; ROM:off_35B0Co
ROM:000CA738 hot_restart_enrich_decay_step_value:.float 0.02
ROM:000CA740 hot_restart_enrich_max_non_idle:.float 0.14999999


EDIT: I've got all the 'post-start' tables as well, just too late to pull all the addresses together now - I'll post as soon as I get the chance.

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Last edited by td-d on Fri Jun 29, 2012 7:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Hot Start Enrichment Tables Found!
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 7:31 pm 
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Posts: 2284
Location: Johannesburg, South Africa
Merp wrote:
Any luck finding a minimum (or max) IPW? I'm trying to determine if the limits occur in the 'preliminary' IPW, or after it is stored in the 4byte logger parameter.


Just checked - from what I could see, it's the 'preliminary' value - i.e. the value that sits directly above the injector flow scaling.

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 Post subject: Re: Hot Start Enrichment Tables Found!
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:01 pm 
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Posts: 760
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td-d wrote:
Merp wrote:
Any luck finding a minimum (or max) IPW? I'm trying to determine if the limits occur in the 'preliminary' IPW, or after it is stored in the 4byte logger parameter.


Just checked - from what I could see, it's the 'preliminary' value - i.e. the value that sits directly above the injector flow scaling.


Awesome, will post my findings when I do some more digging :)

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 Post subject: Re: Hot Start Enrichment Tables Found!
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:05 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 20, 2010 4:01 am
Posts: 2284
Location: Johannesburg, South Africa
Merp wrote:
td-d wrote:
Merp wrote:
Any luck finding a minimum (or max) IPW? I'm trying to determine if the limits occur in the 'preliminary' IPW, or after it is stored in the 4byte logger parameter.


Just checked - from what I could see, it's the 'preliminary' value - i.e. the value that sits directly above the injector flow scaling.


Awesome, will post my findings when I do some more digging :)


Great - can't wait for your programming mode patch! :D

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