RomRaider

This is my base rom and a couple of logs that I have pulled off of it... The larger log is highway cruising and the smaller one is a 3rd gear pull... The fuel, timing, boost, and wastegate are based off subaviators rom found here: topic3813.html

There are a couple of issues that I have with this map as it sits... 1. The highway economy could be better. I feel that it is going to rich @ low boost (below 5lbs) 2. I need to modify the top end boost and wastegate to pull it back a little... It is really pushing the injectors...

I have made what I think are the appropriate changes... and they are on the last map. My LC-1 calibration got messed up this morning so please disregard that. Please review this data and let me know what you think!

Thanks so much guys... I am trying really hard to learn everything I need with this stuff!

I just took a quick look at the map.

I would change the higher load and rpm fueling to around 11:1 to give yourself more IDC headroom. You must be in the high 90's now. If you are not running a walbo pump with this map, get one to be safe.

Cruising on the highway it will be in closed loop and targeting 14.7:1 . Highway fuel economy is not a tuning problem but more likely a mechanical one.

The timing strategy is different than most. You are adding timing advance(maximum) at very low loads. I have never seen that done before. Usually most people including myself, don't add timing advance max before 1.0 load. It might not be an issue, but most have all the timing at low loads in the base timing table.

You also have this scaled out to 3.0 load. That is kind of overkill. With that turbo I bet it's not pulling more than 2.4 or so g/rev. You could lower the highest column to say 2.4 g/rev and add a few lower load columns for more resolution and better performance at lower loads.

But nothing really seems horribly out of whack.

How much timing should be knocked off the max advance map, for Cali 91 gas?
And from what load point..


Thanks.

this looks like an aggressive stage 2 2.0L on either meth injection or decent octane? Mod list would help.

Really need to see the mod list and true AFRs here, as that would have a big impact. pulling 205 g/s on 16 psi tapering to 13 psi at redline on our crappy 91 octane, and AFRs in the 10.7 range @ 7000, I usually see 93-97% duty. As others have said, you may want to target a leaner AFR and run less timing. The car will run a good deal smoother too, not as "lumpy". Be careful to monitor EGTs.

Regarding the Cali gas question, and assuming the OP's car is what I guessed earlier, I can't run that kind of boost and timing on Oklahoma's terrible 91 octane, no way in hell. Usually around 11-13* at peak tq rising to 15-18 at 5500, rising to 25-30 at 7000 depending on the relative VE of the engine in question

Do you have any recommendations on the correlation between the percentage of fuel pulled to the percentage of timing pulled? I have played with the boost / wastegate maps a bit as well as adding going from 0 to 2 in the ol/cl delay table. I have also leaned it out a bit in the cruising range and added a touch of timing in that area.... Cruising mileage has been improved signifigantly.

I regularly see loads approaching 2.75 and higher while under WOT pulls from low rpm. That is why I have decided to stick with the map scaling values...

I think I have a mechanical issue with engine noise. I just removed my heat shield and I am going to clean and re-torque my knock sensor... I would love to see if that made a difference in the timing being pulled above 5000 rpm... I don't hear actual knock by any means...

Mods are custom TBE/ ebay up pipe, snorkus delete, 14lb flywheel. The exhaust is a 3" down pipe running to a 2.5" thrush strait through glasspack and a custom bent 2.5" rear section... I am running ethanol enhanced 93 octane... I am also running the "T-Flip" on my BCS. (Where the strait section connects the BCS to the turbo. the "T" part goes to the wastegate.)

This map also has LC set to 4750rpm.

I am attaching the updated map...

Looks like a lot of timing is being pulled above 5k.

Also your 2.65 and 2.8 base timing columns overlap and are sometime backwards.

It was... Timing was being pulled from engine noise and not actual knock... I took off the turbo heat shield and it stopped pulling near as much timing...

This is really starting to pull hard... ECU Edit was reporting 280tq/240hp on one of my most recent loggs...

Thanks...

can we see some logs after removing the heat shield? I think your timing values look a bit high, but then again I tune pretty conservative on pump gas.

For straight gas 93 octane, a fueling strategy that has worked for me has been 11.8:1 at boost onset tapering to 11.3:1 at redline, but like I said I tune conservative. With your ethanol-treated 93 octane, you might find that going a bit richer will work better, since the ethanol has a much richer stoich ratio.

There is usually power to be gained by leaning the car out, but your timing will need to be lower. I can't tell you how much, because there really isn't a rule of thumb. The VE of the engine, intercooling, ambient temperature, exhaust backpressure, cooling system, etc all play a key role in ignition advance.

The best and only way to find optimal timing advance (MBT) is to strap the car on a dyno where runs can be made in a controlled test environment with good instrumentation to compare the results. However, 91 or 93 octane is virtually unable to allow timing advance to reach MBT on most of our cars, so advancing the timing to the point of knock is almost always going to net more power. Knowing this, I usually find this point, and remove a degree or two from the entire curve, for long term safety. The small sacrifice in power (usually only 5-10 hp) is well worth the long term health. I just don't trust consistency amongst street fuels, even from the same station, to send a car off that's been tuned at the limit of timing advance.

This map was originally made for 550 cc injectors, JDM V7 STI TMIC, Pnp manifolds, uppipe, and TD04HL-15T (JDM WRX) turbo, coolant bypass, Prodrive BCS, PDE Catted DP, 2.5 Stromung midpipe, USDM STI axleback, and Southeast 93 Octane Spring gas. In summer I would run a gallon of Xylene per tank as a precaution. This brings octane up to 95+ Octane. This map was not tuned on Xylene however. I took many ques from Prodrive PPP3 mapping but it is a bit different in terms of boost and fueling. No meth, ever...

Airflows are 225-230 g/s from 6-7,000 rpm at 15-15.5 psi on my setup.

Good job on Scotty to take out some fuel in the cruise range. I have done the same in my latest iteration of the map. IMO this map is a bit much for 440 cc injectors as I like to keep IDC's at or under 80% to suit my comfort level.

True AFR's are 10.7 at redline on my setup, which to me is conservative but the 550's leave me a lot of headroom. In the coming weeks I will add PnP TGV deletes with phenolic spacers.

-soobaviator

soobaviator,

Would you mind letting me take a look @ your latest version of the rom? I would like to compare the changes I made to what you have done...

Thanks much.

Also wanted to add some helpful information as I've seen a lot of "tuned" maps that call for impossible boost profiles relative to spool characteristics and beyond the surge/stall charateristics of various turbos. I have compiled some compressor maps and marked them up with EJ205 airflows according to measured VE at 70 deg OAT and 300 ft above MSL altitude. Hope they are helpful.

All demand lines start at 2,000 rpm and advance in 1,000 rpm increments

TD04L-13T

TD04H-15G

TD04HL-18T

TD04HL-19T

TD05-16G "Small"

TD06-18G




-soobaviator

The latest version is attached.

I turned up boost .7 psi, took out and smoothed timing above 2.0 g/rev, added timing in the cruise range, leaned fuel a bit in the cruise and high load range. Been running this since early last month on pump 93 (10% Ethanol). The only issue I have is some transitional knock which I refuse to chase and the ECU will pull 1 degree on occasion when mashing the throttle at cruise.

Boost is right on map targets and from cruise in 5th gear 22.7 PSI comes up by 2,800 at 50% throttle, no need to drop down a gear to pass! Fuel economy is hard to keep up because I can't keep my foot off the gas!

This is a good map for this turbo and mod set and is very smooth from low rpm in 3rd or 4th gear to high RPM blasts. Smaller intercoolers and stock injectors will have difficulty keeping up with the airflow. I believe the PnP work also makes quite a difference as well as the 15T turbo. It has a slightly larger compressor but the hotside is way bigger, just a tick smaller than a VF39. This makes a big difference in VE I believe. VE is a knock buffer and allows more aggressive timing to be run safely.

Modify and run at your own risk

-soobaviator

Here we go with updated map and log... I pulled a bit of timing starting @ ~4400 rpm 2.5 load to 6800 1.8 load... It is super smooth now. There looks to be a dip where the timing goes kind of flat from about 4400 rpm to 5000 rpm...

What would be the recommended way to tune timing from here? I was thinking of bumping base timing starting @ 1.05 load by 2 degrees and lowering the advance map by 1 degree. I figure that it would start to pull timing where needed and I could fine tune the map a bit... I am definitely open to suggestions and advice guys.

I am pretty pleased so far though... ecuEdit is reporting ~ 259 tq/233 hp to the ground... I just want to smooth it out more now and get a little more under the curve.

Thanks so much guys.

While looking @ the above td04 flow chart it looks like I am probably spinning my turbo well past 150,000 rpm.

My question is, should I be able to run enough timing to pick up any additional power by tweaking my boost targets to better match the map? Would I be able to feel the difference in back preassure? My current targets are within the efficiency range but spin the turbo more.

Current targets are



Based on that map and the rpm speed line I should adjust to the following ranges to keep the speed down...



Input... Thoughts????